Reconstruction talk:Proto-Germanic/smilāną

Etymology
I am wondering if *smīlijanan (for *smiulijanan) is a derivative of the sb. *smeulaz "a smile" (> Middle High German ; ), = to. Otherwise, I doubt whether this form truly existed in PGmc. Leasnam (talk) 18:42, 27 July 2012 (UTC)

I don't know whether "smīlijanan" is the correct form, but I propose it, anyways you may move the page. But I don't think that it comes from "*smeulaz", because "smi-" descended of "*(s)meyh₂".

Greetings HeliosX (talk) 20:23, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Ok. I think it may have gone thusly: "*(s)meyh₂" > *smī-/*smu- > *smeu-laz > *smeul-ijanan > *smiulijanan/*smīlijanan(?). Change from iu to ī is unknown to me, I have only seen one other possible word which might show this same alternation, but it is not confirmed and that is *fleutanan ("flow") vs. *flītanan ("flite"). Otherwise, PGmc iu would be the correct vowel, but that should produce y in Old Norse (*smýla). The other option is that it's smī- + -lōnan (frequentative verbal suffix), which would beget *smīlōnan (> ON smila; but not the MHG word--that would still come from *smiulijanan). Leasnam (talk) 20:40, 27 July 2012 (UTC)

I propose that the Middle High German term "smielen" descended from "*smiulijanan" from either "smeu" + "-lonan" or "smeul" + "-ijanan". By the way, where does the "*-lijanan" come from?

Greetings HeliosX (talk) 20:51, 27 July 2012 (UTC)

English word "to smile" really not Anglo-Saxon?
The article looks as if the English word "to smile" came from the danish language. Or is this my own stupid misinterpretation? In Saterfrisian Language there is the word "smielje", which means "to smile". Beside, there is the word "smüüsterje", which is sometimes combined with the word "laachje", so that the word smüüsterlaachje is formed.

I don't know anything about contacts between Saterfrisians and danes, apart from perhaps the Vikings (Of whom some old Saterfrisians can still tell tales). So I think a word such as "smile" already existed in the common ancestor of Saterfrisian and English language. But perhaps I'm wrong: Saterfriesians also use the "-je"-class for the conjugation of words with a foreign origin, such as "campje" from English "to camp" - and the syllable "camp" is often in an untouched English pronounciation. But also a type of foreign words, which came much earlier. Those romanic or latin words, which end on "-ieren" when they are braught into the German language, in general end on "-ierje" in Sater Frisian. Sometimes, they are really corrupted in Saterfrisian, for Example the word "risselwierje" as a descendant of latin "resolvere".

Saterfrisian Conjugation Examples
Saterfrisian conjugation of verbs with the ending -je is probably a descendant of this Proto-Germanic conjugation class, but if an "l", "n", or "r" (even if the r is, as in general, slured so that it becomes a vocal) comes directly before the ending "-je", the conjugation is slured in a specific way:

smüüsterlaachje (tou smüüsterlaachjen)

PRESENT TENSE: iek smüüsterlaachje du smüüsterlaachest hie / ju / it smüüsterlaachet wie smüüsterlaachje jie smüüsterlaachje jo smüüsterlaachje

SIMPLE PAST TENSE: iek smüüsterlaachede du smüüsterlaachedest hie / ju / it smüüsterlaachede wie smüüsterlaacheden jie smüüsterlaacheden jo smüüsterlaacheden

BUT:

smüüsterje (tou smüüsterjen)

PRESENT TENSE: iek smüüsterje du smüüsterst hie / ju / it smüüstert wie smüüsterje jie smüüsterje jo smüüsterje

SIMPLE PAST TENSE: iek smüüsterde du smüüsterdest hie / ju / it smüüsterde wie smüüsterden jie smüüsterden jo smüüsterden

Greetings, Heinz


 * What we know for sure is that it descends from the Middle English word. Where the current Wiktionary etymology gets the Danish link from I do not know. Most dictionaries put it at either of Low German or Scandinavian origin (to which I would relate Old Norse rather than Danish per se). It is also possible that it was from an unattested OE word, but the ME appearance is not really early enough (13 c), so it was most likely borrowed. Leasnam (talk) 20:27, 16 September 2012 (UTC)
 * According to the Online Etymology Dictionary:

"c.1300, perhaps from M.L.G. *smilen or a Scandinavian source (e.g. Dan. smile, Swed. smila 'smile')"
 * — Ungoliant (Falai) 21:27, 17 September 2012 (UTC)
 * That's just listing byspels of Modern Scandinavian languages (e.g. Danish, Swedish, Faroese) for comparison. That is not to say that it is a conclusive borrowing from the Danish language IMHO Leasnam (talk) 22:55, 17 September 2012 (UTC)