Talk:bum

Talking bum
Why does the nineteenth-century American sense (from German Bummel/bummeln) get top billing over the late middle English sense?

Anus?
Clarification: bum specifically means "anus" in Australia? No it doesn't, not specifically. "Bum" means "buttocks plus intergluteal cleft and anus" ie the entire rear end area. However one might say "up my bum" like an American might say "in my arse" - that would be referring to inserting something in the anal canal by reference to the whole region ie just like "in my rear end". Perhaps this means that "bum" refers to "anus" by association and the two effectively mean the same thing, unsure? The anus, anatomically speaking, is the actual opening to the anal canal and rectum not including buttocks. "Bumhole" or "arsehole" is actually specific slang for "anus" in Australia. Same with Brits that I know.
 * Certainly for British English, yes, it doesn't really mean 'anus' apart from 'up the bum' as you point out. --Mglovesfun (talk) 12:22, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

Butt
Butt is an american word - the british don't use it often, and if they do, it's because we have taken the word from the Americans...

A third meaning
"Bum" (in British English at least) can also mean "bailiff" (someone appointed by a creditor, or by the authorities, to seize a debtor's properties in lieu of payment) &mdash; Agatha Christie used it in this sense in at least one of her novels (Taken at the Flood IIRC). I have a feeling that this may indeed have been the origin of the use of this word in American English to mean "tramp".


 * I believe "bum" in this sense is a shortening of "bumbailiff," which has citations back to the 17th century, which itself comes from the normal British sense + bailiff--a collector is a bailiff who is "on your bum." --75.36.129.3 00:17, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Another slang use
I frequently have heard it used as a positive adjective by young people, is this not a particularly widespread use? It's common here in Manchester, UK.

For example: Jamie is bum (written on bus shelter) Your new car is pretty bum. etc

Tea room discussion
I just split this into the two etymologies. Questions arise:


 * 1) To which etymology belongs the verb sense “to wet the end of a joint?”
 * 2) To which etymology belongs the noun sense “a drinking spree?”
 * 3) Does the adjective sense really have attested comparatives bummer and bummest?

Thanks. —Michael Z. 2008-09-04 19:48 z 


 * Regarding the comparative/superlative: yes, a search of Google books will turn up many print citations for both forms. In fact, I'd be more suprised to see "more bum"/"most bum". --EncycloPetey 20:00, 4 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Geeze, I should have tried the search myself and saved you the trouble. Thanks. —Michael Z. 2008-09-04 21:36 z 

Bum in the US
The article says "bum" is used with children in the US. Who wrote this and what is their source? "Bum" is ONLY used in the US when we're imitating the British. We use other slang words or "butt" with children. Section is highly misleading.
 * People have different ideas of whats appropriate .... definitely I heard "bum" growing up in the US. Teachers may not want to use a word that will make kids giggle, after all ... which "butt" often will even for kids getting close to adolescence in my experience.  I think the Usage notes section we have right now is on the money except for one thing: the choice of which word to use, when the choices are butt, bum, and other child-friendly euphemisms, is probably not a dialectal phenomenon so much as an idiolectal one.  Two parents within the same household will quite possibly use different words.  — Soap — 02:02, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

Etymology mixup?
It is surprising to me that "a person" comes under ety 1 (buttocks) while "lazy person" and "homeless person" come under the very different ety 2. Equinox ◑ 15:38, 10 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Since it's metonymy I'd say maybe the intended usage is e.g. "get your bum over here!" but our definition isn't very informative in that case. — Soap — 01:24, 29 January 2020 (UTC)
 * As an aside, if the sense only exists with pronouns ("your bum"), it might not sense be a something we'd handle as a sense of this entry: compare your ass (separate from as and with a different POS). - -sche (discuss) 08:28, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

Usage label
"(Britain, Ireland, Australia, New Zealand, informal, rare, Canada, US)" I for one have no idea what this means, specifically the scope of the informal and rare bits relative to the geography - does it mean that it's rare in all those countries, or that it's rare in Canada and the US, or that it's rare in the first four countries, or only in New Zealand? 17:19, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Good question. We seem to mix both orders even on this page, so I'd say that it's impossible to determine how to read that. — Soap — 01:23, 29 January 2020 (UTC)


 * I think the usage note explains most of this. It could be expanded with more on British usage. - -sche (discuss) 08:27, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

Timing
Bum cannot be a syncopated form of bottom dating from Middle English if bottom only acquired that sense in 1794. We cant simultaneously make both claims ... either one or the other is speculation on our part. — Soap — 01:00, 29 January 2020 (UTC)


 * I've expanded the etymology to mention this issue directly. Unfortunately, the only source I came across that explicitly connected the dots to spell out that problem is quite old, but modern sources confirm each part (i.e., that bottom does not have this sense until the 1790s), so it's fine. - -sche (discuss) 08:25, 31 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I wanted to mention that even though I brought this up, I still think bum might be derived from bottom. Even if we have no citations for bottom=buttocks before 1794, it could simply be that it was rarely written down, and what was written down hasnt survived.  If w:Kluge's Law is valid, butt and bottom are likely the same word going back to Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/butmaz, and since both bottom and butt can mean buttocks today, it's at least possible that the original word 2,500 years ago also had that sense, and just didn't leave any surviving written evidence of it.  (Note that headbutt is unrelated but the existence of a second "butt" word might have helped drive new meaning into the first etymology.) — Soap — 13:24, 30 April 2023 (UTC)

RFV discussion: October 2021
Anus (as opposed to buttocks); see Talk:bum. Equinox ◑ 04:58, 17 October 2021 (UTC)
 * cited (while ususally this sense is from "up someone's bum", there are two other constructions there. Kiwima (talk) 02:37, 18 October 2021 (UTC)


 * RFV-passed QuickPhyxa (talk) 11:58, 22 October 2021 (UTC)