Talk:dat gezegd hebbende

First of all, the substance of the IPA is spot on; the only thing to remark on is that we don't indicate syllable breaks directly before stress. I am not sure that this phrase is idiomatic, however, even though this kind of grammar is not very usual in Dutch. ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  16:54, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks; I'm just mimicking what I find on other entries, though!
 * Re idiomaticity, I don't know: I feel its English and French equivalents (🇨🇬,, , 🇨🇬, 🇨🇬, etc.) are lexicalised set phrases that deserve entries, and I imagined the same could be said of this, especially in light of the unusual grammar / word order . But if you say it doesn't belong, I guess we can do without. Should I RFD it?
 * What about, btw? PUC – 18:30, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
 * I agree that this is probably less SOP than the French and English counterparts. I don't think there's sufficient reason to RFV it yet. The word order doesn't seem unusual to me though, object + participle seems like the default to me, it's just that this construction isn't very common. I think dat gezegd zijnde is on about the same level when it comes to idiomaticity. But feel free to ask others' input. ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  18:41, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Forget the part about the word order. Another brain fart from me. PUC – 20:26, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
 * No worries. This is a fairly esoteric and subtle matter of grammar and in general you could say that one learns a new language by letting one's brain fart at full blast. ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  10:58, 10 January 2021 (UTC)

, what do you think? Is it worth an entry or should it be deleted? PUC – 11:05, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
 * At first blush it appears to me just another among many similar SOP constructions with a present participle: alles overziende, dit overwegende, dat beschouwende, de vraag terzijde latende. I mean, I do not immediately see a redeeming aspect that would make this one stand out as significantly more idiomatic than any of the others. --Lambiam 11:45, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
 * I would retain it, but only based on the long-standing examples in English and French (with the English lemmas going back to 2006). Morgengave (talk) 11:57, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

RFD discussion: January–February 2021
Should probably be deleted per Talk:dat gezegd hebbende. PUC – 19:10, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Abstain. PUC – 19:10, 8 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Keep. I was on the fence, but I think it can be regarded as a set phrase and the grammar (active participle with a perfect participle forming subordinate clause, with a direct object to boot) is quite unusual for modern Dutch. You could use it with other verbs (and those should generally not be included), but that would result in a rather archaic style. ←₰-→ Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk)  11:28, 9 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment. It is not hard to find instances where it simply means literally what the sum-of-parts suggests, so if this is kept there should also be an &lit sense. --Lambiam 12:16, 10 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep per LBD and per the precedent set by English entries such as that said and its synonyms. — Mnemosientje (t · c) 18:49, 10 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Keep &mdash; Dentonius 08:49, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
 * RFD-kept. Imetsia (talk) 16:58, 22 February 2021 (UTC)