Talk:loup-garou

My last name is Garoutte, and I have been doing research on the origin of "Garoutte", and thus "garou". I have found no data to support the claims made in this Wiktionary entry for 'loup-garou'. I attempted to make corrections, but they were reverted. I sent a message to the fellow who reverted them, and it has gone unanswered. I can find no evidence to support that Loup-garou is a pleonasm, other than modern misuse derived specifically from this very term. It is a compound of 'loup' and 'garou'. 'Loup' clearly means 'wolf'. The only factual evidence I have found for the meaning of 'garou' are here:

From a 1856 French/English dictionary by Alexander G. Collot:

GAROU, sm. wizard. V LOUP-GAROU

(sm = substantive masculine, V = voyez (see) - i.e. see also)

From Randle Cotgrave's 1611 French-English dictionary:

Garou. wild, savage, hideous, cruel.

Garous. (A syncope of words, Gardez-vous, or Garez-vous; take heed, turn aside, look to your selves;) See: Loup-garou

None of these (in 400 years) confirm a connection between 'garou' and 'wolf', except for occurance in the term "loup-garou". I can find no evidence to support the other words used in this entry (garoul, warous, and wari wulf). Unless there is some evidence, I think the unsupported assertions should be removed.

Colen (talk) 06:07, 2 June 2012 (UTC)

But right up to modern French, garou: has meant ‘werewolf’ on its own. Eg ‘L'homme est vêtu de roseaux et d'herbes sèches et coiffé d'une énorme tête en bois, imitant celle de ce bœuf sauvage qui est en même temps une sorte de garou local’ (Morand); ‘De jour, les aspics y venaient boire [dans un ruisseau]; de nuit, les garous’ (Pérochon). So there's a clear continuity. Ƿidsiþ 06:33, 2 June 2012 (UTC)
 * You haven't looked very hard, have you. In Old French, garwaf: was the usual term for a werewolf – it's a cognate of the English and was presumably borrowed from a Germanic source. Eg in Marie de France:
 * Garvalf, ceo est beste salvage;
 * Tant cum il est en cele rage,
 * Hummes devure, grant mal fait,
 * Es granz forest converse e vait...

Thanks.

http://www.cnrtl.fr/definition/garou

http://www.cnrtl.fr/definition/loup-garou

Colen (talk) 07:50, 2 June 2012 (UTC)