Talk:mariachi

Etymology seems a little off, mariachi/mariache supposedly being of French origin. Only a few seconds on Google yields:

"The consensus of modern scholars is that the word mariachi is indigenous to Mexico. The now-extinct Coca language of central Jalisco is that most frequently cited as its probable source. Legend erroneously attributes the word to the French Intervention of the 1860s, explaining it as a corruption of the French word mariage, and citing a similarity between mariachi (or its archaic variant, mariache) and the French word for wedding. Historical documents prove that both the word mariachi and the ensemble it designates pre-date the French occupation of Mexico, making any similarity with the French word a phonetic coincidence." - http://www.sobrino.net/mer/entry_on_the_word_mariachi.htm

"Musicologists and folklorists have argued for years over the origin of mariachi. Standard Spanish dictionaries and encyclopedias name the French word mariage (meaning wedding or marriage) as a possible origin, and date it back to the 1860s, when Maximillian of Habsburg was Emperor of Mexico. This theory was probably first put forward by Alfonso Reyes. Another probable theory of the origin of the word mariachi is that it originated in the language of the Cora, an indigenous people of Nayarit (not Jalisco where the band originated)." - http://www.mariachi-plaza.com/mariachi-history.htm

"Mariachis first appeared in Cocula in central Jalisco sometime in the early 19th century, but the first verifiable mention of them is in a letter from a Catholic priest written in 1852. This poses a weighty argument against the folk etymology that claims the word “mariachi” derives from the French word for “marriage.” This is extremely unlikely, since the French did not arrive in Mexico until 1864 and it isn’t on record that any Frenchman ever set foot in Jalisco, much less got married here. Other possible derivations, such as the claim they were named after a Virgin called Maria H. (Mah-ri-ah-chay), are even more far fetched and, in fact, we may never know exactly how the name evolved." - http://www.chapala.com/chapala/magnifecentmexico/vivanmariachis/vivanmariachis.html

"The word mariachi was thought to have derived from the French word “mariage" (marriage) dating from the French Intervention in Mexico in the 1860s, related to the music’s appearance at weddings. This was a common explanation on record jackets and travel brochures. However, this theory was disproven with the appearance of documents that showed that the word existed before this invasion. The origin of the word is still in dispute but the most of the promenent theories state that it has indigenous roots. One states that it comes from the name of the wood from which the dance platform is made. Another states that “mariachi” comes from the indigenous name of a tree called pilla or cirimo and yet another states that it came from an image locally called “María H” (pronounced mah-ree-ah AH-chay)." - the almighty http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariachi#Name

Please, let us *actively* refrain from telling it as it is, if we haven't a clue, or (worse) if the subject matter is a grey area. I enjoy tracing etymological lines, and so my inner camelspit detector set off when reading the so-called "common explanation". Hoping for others to do the same, I stress that some of the most savage disputes between men are in ideology owed to differing analyses and translations of religious texts (translations as harmless seeming out-of-context as the association between a musician and religious ceremony). I fail to see how admitting that an idea is very old and/or open to multiple possible definitions in any way stops us from reaching correct answers, if you go digging in the wrong place, you'll have to dig until it bleeds, never finding treasure.

Not sure if I'm to sign here, bAbuN -11:54AM Helsinki, Finland