Talk:sic

RFV discussion: July 2015
I would like to challenge this "Adverb" sense in the entry sic:


 * 1) thus; thus written

I recently created for uses of sic between square brackets. (and (sic) since it appears parenthesized sometimes in Google Books) I also moved the usage notes from sic to about this use. My rationale is that, since it seems to be, in a way, always "separate" from the text and used between square brackets, syntactically it behaves more as a symbol, like an asterisk or a footnote. For comparison, I also created recently, while (...) I created in 2010. IMHO, sic shouldn't be defined as a normal adverb unless it can really be found in running text as a normal adverb. Thoughts? --Daniel Carrero (talk) 05:52, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
 * I don't agree that, just because it's only ever used as a parenthetical aside, it's not a ‘normal adverb’ (whatever that means). The main definition should be at sic: without brackets, as in Wikipedia and every other dictionary. Ƿidsiþ 14:53, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
 * I agree that the sense should be at sic; compare this brief discussion of (aq). The sense is also used without brackets, as in:
 * 1971, H. E. Wilkie Young and Elie Khadouri[e], Mosul in 1909, in Middle Eastern Studies, volume 7, page 229 (quoted in 2014, William Taylor, Narratives of Identity: The Syrian Orthodox Church and the Church of England ISBN 1443869465, page 207):
 * When it is all over they merge and go in a body to visit [...] the Telegraph Office – with plausible expressions of regret and excuses for the mob 'which' they say 'is deplorably ignorant and will not be restrained when its feelings are strongly moved' – sic, the fact being that the mob's feelings will never be 'moved' unless it is by one of them.
 * And other parenthetical information may be added to the brackets, as in:
 * 1884, James Grant, Cassell's old and new Edinburgh, page 99:
 * This I may say of her, to which all that saw her will bear record, that her only countenance moved [sic, meaning that its expression alone was touching], although she had not spoken a word
 * 2004, Michael Cook, Studies in the Origins of Early Islamic Culture and Tradition, page 43:
 * then the kingship of the Romans (Rum) moved (sic: kharaja) from the family of Heraclius to Leo (Liyun) and his son after him.
 * ... showing that the brackets are not part of the word. - -sche (discuss) 19:20, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
 * One quote that does suggest that the brackets are to some extent seen as part of the word:
 * "The question of wether or not to give anonymity to criminals in cases like this will go on forever," intoned madam – and you may care to know there is a [sic] bag in the rear pocket of the seat in front of you. (source)
 * But of course there it's being used in a playful punning sense. Some more citations which suggest the brackets are not essential:
 * 1939, Benjamin Britten, Letters from a Life Vol 2: 1939-45: Selected Letters and Diaries of Benjamin Britten, Faber & Faber ISBN 9780571265923
 * The only person who wrote to me about 'duty', 'conscience' – 'being a pacifist at heart, but this was a war', etc... – (sic, sic, sic!!!); was he of that noble ancestry.
 * 2010, Paul Booth, Digital Fandom: New Media Studies, Peter Lang ISBN 9781433110702, page 127
 * Jim &#39;s Interests: General: Working out, hanging out at the local bars, expanding my mind, eating Tuna Sandwhiches...or so I&#39;m told and poker...  Television: ... this show that&#39;s on Thuresday nights at 8 :30pm... I can&#39;t place the  name of it but it has this crazy interview style thing...[all sic]
 * 2012, editor of Too Brief a Treat: The Letters of Truman Capote, Vintage ISBN 9780345803092
 * I have ignored occasional errors of grammar, such as “she has not written either Jack or I.&quot; Too many &quot;[sics]&quot; I find obnoxious. (Note that they didn't say "too many [sic]s")
 * I don't like the idea of having the main entry at for several reasons - bracket shape is not fixed, bracket use is not compulsory, and unsupported titles are incredibly ugly. Smurrayinchester (talk) 13:10, 20 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Actually, even better - unambiguous adverbial use:
 * 2012, Milton J. Bates, The Bark River Chronicles: Stories from a Wisconsin Watershed, Wisconsin Historical Society ISBN 9780870206047, page 271
 * whole bussiness: Quoted sic in George F. Willison, Saints and Strangers ( New York: Reynal and Hitchcock, 1945)
 * 2006, Christina Scull, Wayne G. Hammond, JRR Tolkien companion & guide, Houghton Mifflin Harcourt ISBN 9780618391028
 * *Joseph Wright, his predecessor in the chair, called him &#39;a firstrate Scholar and a kind of man who will easily make friends&#39; at Oxford (quoted, sic, in E.M. Wright,  The Life of Joseph Wright (1932), p. 483).
 * 2003, Monika Fludernik, The Fictions of Language and the Languages of Fiction, Routledge ISBN 9781134872879, page 468
 * Bolinger, Dwight (1977) 'Pronoun and repeated nouns.' Lingua18:1-34 [Quoted sic in Toolan 1990. Neither in Lingua 18, nor in the 1977 volume of  that journal.]
 * Smurrayinchester (talk) 13:25, 20 July 2015 (UTC)

"It may also be used to highlight a perceived error, sometimes for the purpose of ridicule, as in this example from The Times:
 * Why woudn't we have the bracketed form be a redirect to the unbracketed form and show both as usage examples. Keeping punctuation out of headwords of lemmas whenever possible seems like a worthy goal. DCDuring TALK 13:40, 20 July 2015 (UTC)
 * I have redirected the bracketed forms — compare (aq) — and removed the RFV template based on the citations above. I have also removed the following bit, because it isn't a very good example of the use of "sic" to ridicule a perceived error — it isn't even a "perceived error", it's (in the second case) a plain and simple error of spelling/grammar. We can find a better example, I imagine. - -sche (discuss) 01:44, 24 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Warehouse has been around for 30 years and has 263 stores, suggesting a large fan base. The chain sums up its appeal thus: 'styley [sic], confident, sexy, glamorous, edgy, clean and individual, with it's [sic] finger on the fashion pulse.'"

sicc
Shouldn’t this be moved to its own page? H. (talk) 08:56, 11 November 2019 (UTC)

sic!
In German this often gets an exclamation mark. What about English? (Personally not a fan of this spelling because it feels like "Yes! Look! They really spelt this wrong!", but anyway it's common.) 2.202.159.25 00:31, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

RFM discussion: November 2020–April 2022

 * See