Talk:zuordnen

RFD discussion: March 2022–November 2023
Rfd-redundant: 7 senses? My creativity stops after 1... &mdash; Fytcha〈 T | L | C 〉 01:05, 15 March 2022 (UTC)
 * It may be helpful if you identify (here and elsewhere) which senses you find redundant. For the purpose of translating from language X to language Y, it may be good to provide an Übersetzungspalette of near synonyms, since some are more appropriate in some contexts while in other contexts other translations work better. See the range at Leo.  --Lambiam 20:09, 15 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Many of the redundant senses have already been quietly removed/changed in the meantime (alongside the rfd-sense templates), though I still think that only has one sense. I agree that usually a sense should contain more than just one word in order to clarify which sense of the English translation is meant exactly (what does e.g. "to refer" mean in the article ?), but that's not the issue here. There's a clear difference between:
 * zuordnen:
 * to assign
 * to allocate
 * to ascribe
 * and
 * zuordnen:
 * to assign, allocate, ascribe
 * I can explain the difference in case somebody doesn't know what it is. As it stands, there seem to be large-scale errors related to senses in German articles (which is extremely discouraging to me). I don't think there's a systematic way to find them all...
 * While we're at it, there are more large-scale errors in the German category: protologisms / SOPs (User_talk:Hans-Friedrich_Tamke, ...) and translations (,, Special:Diff/63168437/63119234, ...). &mdash; Fytcha〈 T | L | C 〉 10:50, 20 March 2022 (UTC)
 * These translation may cover what for you is one sense, but allocate and ascribe are not synonyms in English. If it is said that a work has been ascribed to a maker (as in a number of other works are ascribed to the Master of the View of Saint Gudula on the basis of a style comparison, translating dem werden durch Stilvergleich noch einige andere Werke zugeordnet &thinsp;), you cannot replace the word by allocated . There is a clear overlap between allocate and assign, perhaps some but less clear between assign and ascribe, while the third edge completing the triangle is not clear at all. In a context like that of the Master of the View of Saint Gudula,  is a synonym of ascribe, but also not of allocate.  --Lambiam 15:21, 20 March 2022 (UTC)
 * The multiple glosses of one and the same sense need not be synonymous; they usually are when separated by a semicolon but when they're separated by commas they usually serve to circumlocute the foreign word in question; here, they signify that the German word is in a sense a hypernym of (the right senses of) the given English glosses. Moreover, does not lose or gain senses depending on which language it is being defined in. Apart from specific circumstances like subsenses or senses labeled (figurative) and/or (by extension), different senses should occupy pairwise disjoint regions in the semantic space. The word in question only has one sense and it roughly corresponds to "to establish a relation between two non-empty sets" but as most readers are more interested in practical translations rather than razor-sharp philosophical demarcations, we ought to try and provide English words that cover the identified region (region in the mathematical sense) as well as possible. While this can be done perfectly in the case of number words (zweiundsiebzig = seventy-two), technical jargon (Benzyladenin = benzyladenine) and the likes, it isn't possible in general, neither here. The English glosses that serve as circumlocutions belong on one line as long as they approximate the same sense, the same semantic region. &mdash; Fytcha〈 T | L | C 〉 16:15, 22 March 2022 (UTC)


 * I've revised the entry, dropping "ascribe" (not a good general translation, even though it works in some contexts: "assign" is better, think, as it works in both those and other contexts), "dedicate" and "refer" (which again seem like translations that would only work in certain specified contexts and are better covered by the remaining more general translations, no?). We could give examples of 'more specific' situational/contextual translations via usexes. Our colleagues at the German Wiktionary and DWDS perceive two senses (the Duden only really explicitly covers the first of them), although I can see how even those two could be combined. - -sche (discuss) 01:45, 25 March 2022 (UTC)

RFD-kept. I think this has been resolved to satisfaction. The RFD has been long removed. —Caoimhin ceallach (talk) 01:31, 21 November 2023 (UTC)