Wiktionary:Grease pit/2008/September

monobooks.js - can it do this?
Is it possible to automatically expand templates that are collapsed by default? I'm talking in particular about the various Spanish conjugation templates: Template:es-conj-ar, Template:es-conj-egir, Template:es-conj-car, etc, which may all be found at Category:Spanish conjugation templates. By default they're collapsed with a button to show them on the right. I can see how this would be helpful for some people, but I would rather have them expanded automatically. Is there a .js or .css script available to do this? Thanks, FlamingSilmaril 14:26, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes- go to WT:PREFS and check "Alternatively, leave ALL translation sections expanded (and similar hidden sections) - Default is to leave them collapsed". Nadando 16:56, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Great, thanks! FlamingSilmaril 18:45, 1 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Perhaps WT:PREFS should include a note on how to rig your monobook.js so that the chosen pref travels with you from computer to computer.—msh210 ℠ 21:53, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

Template:hy-noun
Opiaterein has disabled the tr= function of this template, making the transcription the unnnamed parameter instead. How strongly do we care about using tr= to consistently mark transliterations in non-Laitn script templates? --EncycloPetey 17:15, 2 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Fairly strongly. Certainly if a template already uses tr= for the transliteration, breaking it is unacceptable. (From the note on your talk page, Ric seems to be under the mistaken impression that {1} can't be used for plural form, etc, while leaving tr= as is? Does he not understand that named parameters aren't counted? That in, e.g. that "plur" is {1}? And do note the edit summary please.) In any case, should be put back and extended properly. Robert Ullmann 17:30, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
 * He understands, but as he notes on his talk page, he prefers the unnumbered linear style. --EncycloPetey 17:37, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
 * 'kay. Just another little mess someone will clean up someday. Robert Ullmann 16:07, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Template:sense
Circeus has added a space to the end of this template. I don't see why anyone using the template wouldn't follow it with a space anyway. This now means that we get two spaces after the colon (if the template is set up to produce a colon) instead of one; it also suggests that he/she has used it on at least one page and not explicitly followed it with a space, meaning that if we roll this back, we will have missing spaces on those pages. &mdash; Paul G 11:28, 5 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I would think it would be good to place a plain space after the colon to always ensure a space after it.


 * A non-breaking space is problematic, because it will sometimes create a double space where there is another space after the template. This will give an inconsistent presentation, and modern typography uses single spaces after colons anyway (double spaces are a typewriting convention, and a characteristic of Victorian typography). —Michael Z. 2008-09-05 14:11 z 


 * I see no reason to include a space at the end of this template. We don't do it to any other template, and any sane person would put a space between the colon displayed at the end of this template and any folowing words. --EncycloPetey 15:42, 5 September 2008 (UTC)


 * He was editing angle bracket, added a sense usage without a space, then added the space to the template instead of the entry? Makes little sense to me ;-) There isn't any reason for this; I'm just going to put it back the way it was. Right now, all of our other pages that use {sense} are displaying extra space. (He subsequently added a uses of {sense} to debacle w/o depending on the space ...) Robert Ullmann 16:04, 5 September 2008 (UTC)


 * There should be one plain space following the colon in the template. In HTML, multiple whitespace characters in the code get rendered as a single space on the page. So even if one editor ever forgets to add a space once, this will still display correctly, instead of having subsequent text set flush with the colon (which is always wrong in English).  In all other cases it will have no effect. —Michael Z. 2008-09-05 16:57 z 


 * No. It creates the opposite problem: editors leaving out the desired space in the wikitext because it "isn't needed" or they don't notice, or (worst) "it doesn't belong there, it is in the template!". Much more severe problem than the occasional omitted space in the text. Robert Ullmann 17:39, 5 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't see what the problem is—searching in the wikitext for terms which follow the template?


 * Following the programmer's dictum of being liberal in what input to accept and conservative in what to output, the template may as well prevent that occasional omitted space from ever occurring.


 * We don't do it for other templates, but other templates don't end with a colon. Come to think of it, offhand I can think of no reason not to add a plain space to context templates and all others in round brackets. —Michael Z. 2008-09-07 20:09 z 
 * Normally, I'd make a case for adding a space to the derivatives too. However, I think (it would certainly explain why I so rarely runs into it in articles) it is amongst the AutoFormat fixes (and if it isn't it should be easy to add should it be felt a good idea), hence I would tend to agree it is not strictly needed. This was sort of a reverse reflex from Wikipedia, where I am constantly editing tample to remove extraneous whitespace. Circeus 03:38, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Special:WantedPages
I think it is time that this page was regenerated. A lot has happened here since September 2007, and I for one would like to see a new list there. I understand that there were some performance issues with having this done on a regular basis, but a one-time regeneration would be sufficient for several months. – Krun 16:26, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately, we haven't had an XML dump for many months now (June), so anything generated would already be three months out-of-date. If you can add your voice to those clamoring for an XML dump, it might help push that into happening. --EncycloPetey 18:04, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Different things. The Special page is generated from the SQL database; the same task queue generates the others (which, note, have been updated twice a week all along). But trying to get it re-enabled will bump you into the same swamped couple of people who can't get the XML dumps going ... (-) Robert Ullmann 18:41, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Without a new XML dump, even a workaround like User:Connel_MacKenzie/Wantedpages cannot be regenerated. -- Gauss 11:53, 7 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Relatedly: Most_missed_articles. Conrad.Irwin 12:00, 7 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Looking at this last, many seem to be poorly selected, obsolete, and untested links coming from WP. Would there be an easy way to generate a list of bad WP links to Wiktionary? Is there an easy way to do this at WP? I haven't looked there yet. DCDuring TALK 12:58, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

order of templates
How would people feel about changing the order of the templates list during an edit so comparative comes before superlative? RJFJR 00:30, 6 September 2008 (UTC)


 * That makes loads of sense. Done. —Ruakh TALK 01:19, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

Uncategorized pages strangeness
Special:UncategorizedPages includes the Italian noun incidente stradale. This is in Category:Italian nouns, and has been since the entry was created on 31 August. Any ideas? SemperBlotto 10:21, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

p.s. Also scioperi della fame


 * These two entries don't appear in their respective categories at present. Looks like the cat membership didn't get updated on the save. (I'm noting more and more of this from the WM s/w, not being able to update cats on saves and thing like template edits, I think there is a serious bug out there.) If we purge these two pages, I suspect they will show up in the cats just fine, and not be in the next update of the special page. Robert Ullmann 12:51, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

converting "old" ety templates to Template:etyl
As Atelaes has been asking for AF to convert templates to, I've done some analysis and set up a list for AF.


 * current state of affairs: User:Robert Ullmann/t18
 * see the control file here: User:AutoFormat/Ety temps

AF will then be converting them over time, while also catching new uses by occasional contributors or those that haven't shifted to "etyl" yet. Comments anyone? Robert Ullmann 15:50, 7 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Am I correct in assuming that the conversion process will not convert the handful of templates that involve "languages" that do not have ISO 639 codes? (New Latin, Late Latin, Medieval Latin, Vulgar Latin are the ones I'm familiar with.) Or is there another way of handling these without losing information? DCDuring TALK 18:14, 7 September 2008 (UTC)


 * That's what his file says. Just the easy ones. --Bequw → ¢ • τ 19:24, 7 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Right. Late Latin can't be used in {etyl} as it stands now even if we invented a non-standard code, as it would link to Late Latin language. The language ages and groups and such we want to refer to in etys have to be done differently. (I have several different ideas. In the meantime, it would be good not to have for German, and  for Germanic. The first goes to {etyl|de}, the latter to {proto|Germanic} or to a group (Germanic languages? Yup.), but we'd have to look at how it is being used. Possibly both ways ... Robert Ullmann 17:48, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Template:Bolivia
I have just created the Regional template: Template:Bolivia. Although there seem to be the pages pito, pega, cachar using this template, they don't appear in the Category:Category:Bolivian Spanish. Probably I have overseen something, as I am no template expert. Could someone please help to fix this problem? Matthias Buchmeier 10:53, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * (can't edit this page any more)


 * Too big? Something broken? Anyway, won't load completely. If anyone can combine this section with above?


 * The Template:Bolivia problem is broken WM s/w: when #ifexists was changed to explicitly add links to the link table, we were told it was so pages could be updated if an entry was added. This, of course, has never actually worked. In the meantime, the ability of the s/w to update categories has been slowly deteriorating. (Note the section two above that one as well.) Only fix is to purge the relevant pages. If you look at Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:Bolivia you will see that they do appear in the links table. Robert Ullmann 16:44, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I've archived March, and fixed some &#x7B;&#x7B; &hellip; &#x7D;&#x7D; imbalances that were making MediaWiki be crazy and not show [edit] links for a whole bunch of segments; hopefully one or both of these changes will make you able to edit? —Ruakh TALK 17:06, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, thank you. It would display the whole page, but I have to be able to section edit. And as you note, no links. (And nto even section numbers when I manually put them in the edit URL ;-) Robert Ullmann 17:42, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Does that mean that it would be sufficient to purge only the template or that all relevant pages including the category and entry pages have to be purged? Do you think there is a chance that future MW versions will fix this problem? Matthias Buchmeier 09:57, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Purging the pages. Editing the template should work, but almost always does not. Sure, they might fix it someday, but since they broke it essentially on purpose, I wouldn't hold your breath. Robert Ullmann 15:50, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

 is great, but…
…it needs some work. Someone tech-savvy should have a look at this and then we should be promoting this template actively on WT:" and convert all the {{RQ -templates to use it as well. H. (talk) 15:16, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * there is often a comma after the last item on the first line, this should not be
 * it would be great to have a parameter to add additional information (such as the Stephanus pagination number for a work of Plato)
 * maybe we should make a second version to be used in the Citations namespace, instead of requiring the strange indent2=*: parameter}}
 * maybe we should include the first indent as well, at least make this more consistent


 * Re: comma: Quotations currently mandates that comma. However, discussion at its talk-page suggests that some editors would prefer a colon.
 * Re: additional information: OMG, abandon all hope. The template is great for typical cases, but I don't think it can cover stuff like this. OTOH, might it be worth creating a special template for quoting from works of Plato?
 * Re: indents: Another option is to use HTML-style markup to achieve the indent, so that the template will work regardless of its context
 * —Ruakh TALK 17:02, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * This is a wikipedia import that is already trying to do way too much. The quotation itself should be taken out of the template, and the wikisyntax (*: etc) as well; it should generate only the citation line, like the RQ templates. (And the specific RQ templates should be kept, they often have specific links that are useful.) Trying to "fix" it with crap like the "indent2=" parameter will just create more problems. Robert Ullmann 17:38, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I use {{temp|cite-book}} in the citations namespace (which is not the same as the clone of wikipedia's {{temp|cite book}} which we also have clogging up the airways), it seems to perform adequately there. Conrad.Irwin 07:46, 12 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Then should I maybe put a warning on the template that it is not to be used? Or that certain parameters are deprecated (such as passage=)?  I think indeed it could do good stuff if we confine it to the citation line only.


 * I hate that comma.


 * Note that it needs some additional parameters, such as volume= and chapter-title= (or, alternatively, chapter-number=). H. (talk) 09:27, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

preload templates broken
Seemingly, if someone tries to use a preload template to make a page that has an apostrophe in it, the apostrophe and everything after it get converted to a single ampersand. See Pickett&. Is there anything that can be done about this?—msh210 ℠ 21:10, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * It isn't the preload templates per se, it is that Mediawiki:Noexactmatch is using uses   with , which mishandles wide unicode in this case. Fixed by using   (better/faster anyway). Did not affect data. Program also reads the deletion log, but that doesn't show the ID that was deleted, only the title, so it doesn't work as well as I'd like. (can still be improved)


 * process has current updates, and has caught up to about 1/5 of the stuff from the last 4 months; new dump in a little while. Robert Ullmann 15:31, 2 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Many of us are looking forward to a usable dump and, especially, the many useful lists that such a dump enables. And, just as washing a car is thought to be one of the best ways to end a drought, the successful completion of your efforts and your strong mojo are likely to cause WMF dumps to get back on schedule. DCDuring TALK 15:58, 2 October 2008 (UTC)


 * IIRC, the WMF intended dump schedule isn't as good as RU's, anyway. ;-)  —Ruakh TALK 16:11, 2 October 2008 (UTC)


 * They are supposedly installing the new servers today, and may start running dumps soon. But there is no indication that they will fix the queueing problems that often see the 90-minute en.wikt dump we want stuck behind a the 6-week long en.wp all-history dump. If they do manage to produce new dumps every few weeks, fine; we can then easily continue to spin dailies. (2 Oct available in an hour or two.) Robert Ullmann 16:21, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

credit where due while I have spent a dozen pleasant hours writing and tweaking code, credit must go to Amgine for providing a platform and Conrad for setting up access etc. Robert Ullmann 00:12, 3 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Is there a reason that the dumps produced don't have a root node? They are lists of 'page' nodes rather than having a root like 'mediawiki'. It's not much of a problem to fix them for analysis, I was just curious. --Bequw → ¢ • τ 10:05, 28 November 2008 (UTC)


 * It is just simpler, not to have to copy and update the "header" on the file, given that all the s/w I know of that reads it is just looking for a set of pages. (The Readme.txt says this) If you need it I can add something. (And then should properly add the close tag at the very end, that isn't there either. ;-) You have s/w that uses it? Robert Ullmann 10:28, 28 November 2008 (UTC)


 * I use AWB and pywikipedia which both aren't smart enough to deal with an XML w/o a root. Only worry if there are others that would like to use these tools, I'm fine. --Bequw → ¢ • τ 07:27, 30 November 2008 (UTC)


 * (pywikipedia xmlreader.py works just fine for me?) Anyway, I've fixed this to generate the "header" and the close tag at the very end; if you get the 1 December dump (and following of course) it should be fine. Tell me if it isn't right. Robert Ullmann 15:43, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Devtionary use for live mirroring?
I have no problem providing bandwidth and platform for Devtionary, and was wondering if it might be useful/possible to set it up to livemirror en.wiktionary?

template:temp and lang=
Would it be possible to adjust so that when it receives a "lang=" parameter it displays it as text rather than interpreting it as a parameter? e.g. would display as  rather than as. Thryduulf 16:06, 17 September 2008 (UTC)


 * You do know the general way to do this? Write . In general, use explicit n= if the parameter contains an "=". Works with all templates. (And it is good to remember that the script templates typically generate strings containing =, so if you use one within a numbered parameter in another template, you will need this.) Robert Ullmann 18:11, 17 September 2008 (UTC)


 * That's how I do it, but it's not perfect, since you if you do it for one parameter, you have to either do it for all the parameters after it, or precede it with a dummy empty parameter that gets overridden. By which I mean, produces : the <tt>bar=baz</tt> gets overridden by <tt>bip</tt> by virtue of the latter being the actual second unnamed parameter, and appearing after it; so one has to put either  (which produces ) or  (which produces ). The whole thing almost defeats the point of using unnamed parameters (which is why I mostly avoid them in templates I create). Another approach that I've seen someone use — either Conrad.Irwin or Mzajac, I think — and which people might find more intuitive is to use <tt>&lt;nowiki>=&lt;/nowiki></tt>, e.g.  (which produces ). Similarly, one can use a numeric character reference, as in  (which produces ). Unfortunately, neither of these approaches works for the situation you describe with the script templates. —Ruakh <i >TALK</i > 01:55, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

merging Template:see (also) and Template:xsee (aka xalso)
I'm putting together a template that will do both, so we don't need two variants (sometimes in the same entry). Presently at User:Robert Ullmann/t.

My intent is to make this the new, and then continue converting {see} to {also}, and also convert {xsee} to {also}. I still need to check all the uses of {xsee} to make sure it is understood. Robert Ullmann 18:15, 17 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Decided this was a bad idea. Technically not a problem, but there are only a small number (couple of hundred) pages that use {xsee}, and 10's of thousands that use {see}/{also}. So not worth the overhead. (For now, if we could get a wlink: parser function that would be different.) Robert Ullmann 16:22, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

Navigation issues
The navigation box doesn't seem to be working- Mainpage-url doesn't go anywhere, nor does Discussionrooms-url. Teh Rote 16:15, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Could this be related to some odd changes in RC? I noticed today that (1) The "Main page" link there no longer works; the link says "Mainpage-text" and points to [ttp://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/INVALID-TITLE], which it didn't do yesterday. (This problem seems common to every page) (2) There is no longer a runing count of the number of entries on Wiktionary in the header text. --EncycloPetey 19:25, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Amgine has been doing something with the sidebar text; I'm not sure what. Robert Ullmann 19:30, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Amgine is on in the IRC. I'll ask. --EncycloPetey 19:32, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Neither Amgine nor Brion kows what is causing the problem. --EncycloPetey 19:33, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * the problem is the "null" edits Amgine made to the URLs. Adding a blank line above the expected line is not a "null edit"! Rolled those back, so the links work. Now we need to fix the text. Robert Ullmann 19:35, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Don't know why MediaWiki:Mainpage-text isn't getting picked up again? So we are getting "Mainpage-text" instead of "Main Page"? Robert Ullmann 19:41, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I deleted the sidebar/en copy that Amgine had added; but that isn't fixing it; it all looks right now (the configuration, not the result!). Caching? Does everyone else still see "Mainpage-text" and "Discussionrooms" (with no space)? Or is it fixing itself? Robert Ullmann 19:45, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Still looks wrong for me, but that may be related to caching, as you say. --EncycloPetey 19:47, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Wrong for me as well. I'm annoying #-tech with trying to get it fixed, and they have been doing something which they are not confiding to a mere plebe such as myself. - Amgine/talk 19:56, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Ah, purging those messages themselves seems to have worked nicely ;-) Robert Ullmann 19:58, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * <grumbles about calling the cavalry> Thanks Robert. - Amgine/talk 20:01, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Recent Changes
Up until today, the current page count displayed in Recent Changes. It no longer does. --EncycloPetey 20:11, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Should be fixed now. Robert Ullmann 23:47, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It is. Thanks. --EncycloPetey 00:21, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

substantialis
This page was obviously deleted by someone, but there are no entries in the deletion log- anyone know what's causing this? Nadando 20:39, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I deleted it. It read "I need help". SemperBlotto 21:24, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Do you recall when? It should appear in the Delete logs regardless. --EncycloPetey 21:25, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * This morning. About 8 o'clock UK time (07:00-ish). SemperBlotto 21:34, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * It does not appear in the delete log. Something odd going on. Robert Ullmann 05:29, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

MediaWiki:Noarticletext
It used to be that when I'd visit a redlink, I'd see the contents of [[MediaWiki:Noarticletext]]. How come that's no longer the case? It still seems to work for Wikipedia.

Also, unrelatedly except that I discovered it while trying to look through Wikipedia's MediaWiki pages, how come [[Special:PrefixIndex]] copies <tt>from</tt> to <tt>prefix</tt> when the latter isn't specified, rather than assuming an empty string? That's a bug, right?

—Ruakh <i >TALK</i > 17:13, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I dunno, I tried &action=purge on the page and it seems to be back now. Probably just an issue with the message cache. Conrad.Irwin 17:57, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Cool, thanks. MediaWiki seems to have gone downhill in this regard. —Ruakh <i >TALK</i > 19:16, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Indeed, someone apparently tried to combine PrefixIndex and AllPages in some way about a month ago, and succeeded only in severely breaking both; despite repeated requests they have not been restored. The people "working" on the s/w seem to be spending their time making things "neater", or adding "features", breaking things as they go; fixing the 1000's of outstanding bugs is not a priority. With volunteers doing things, this will tend to happen, it takes project direction to control it. Robert Ullmann 05:21, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Extension:Nuke
Fyi: There has been a decision at Metapub (link to old version) to add mw:Extension:Nuke to all WMF wikis that don't opt out of it. I know nothing more (not, e.g., when it will be implemented, or how the opt-out procedure will work).—msh210 ℠ 19:06, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I would hope that there would be an option to mass restore as well as delete if this were implemented. Nadando 21:52, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * There is no "mass restore". I'd say quite strongly that we want to opt-out; we have not had any serious need for something like this; if we did we have the technical ability to script it when needed (e.g. I essentially have the code; others can do it). And there is no need for a steward to use it to clean up here, we take care of ourselves. (I don't suppose I need point out the downsides of WF aquiring this?) Why it is not restricted to stewards and 'crats is beyond my comprehension. Robert Ullmann 06:32, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * If there is no mass restore, and insufficient restriction as Robert has noted, then I agree solidly with him that we should opt out. We don't have a need for this, and there is too much potential for harm. --EncycloPetey 06:35, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I, too, feel a bit of apprehension at such a thing. I see no benefit, and a decent amount of risk involved.  Please, let's opt out.  -Atelaes λάλει ἐμοί 06:38, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm not involved in such technical aspects of working on this project, but I am sympathetic to the concerns raised by other, more experienced editors (Robert Ullmann, EncycloPetey, Atelaes). __meco 08:03, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm with meco: opt out!—msh210 ℠ 17:45, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Should we start a !vote to opt out, or should we wait until we know how the opt-out procedure will work? —Ruakh <i >TALK</i > 11:02, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The question has been asked on Metapub by ru.wp and by me. There doesn't seem to be a list or such yet. Robert Ullmann 11:14, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Is there an implementation date scheduled? DCDuring <i >TALK</i > 11:18, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Now there is an opt-out list. We are listed on it, but as unconfirmed (it says "link?", apparently seeking a link to where we voted to opt out). I haven't time to draft a vote page for this.—msh210 ℠ 16:47, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

RC - current nummber of entries
The count seems frozen right now. Normally, it climbs as new "good" articles are added, but it's not changing right now. Is this related to the slow response and numerous server errors today, or is it perhaps a separate problem? --EncycloPetey 21:40, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Addendum: On the IRC, Nadando indicated that this was a deliberate disabling while MW fixes happen. --EncycloPetey 06:36, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * If anyone is interested in some of the gory detail, see this. One thing to note is that when the counter runs again, it will have missed the new entries in the meantime until an update is run. So don't expect it to jump immediately to the correct value when it starts moving. Robert Ullmann 11:03, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Seems to be working again, although the count is still off (how often are updates run?) Nadando 07:10, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The update is a one-off run, done when something has caused to counter to be in error. Don't know when they will run it. The problem may not be fixed yet. Robert Ullmann 15:39, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

<tt></tt>
Hello, User:CyberSkull has created this template and edited Category:Persian derivations with some strange results, for example at Category:arc:Persian derivations. I would really appreciate it someone could explain to me the purpose of it and the new format or structure for the etymology categories, and if this could be fixed, thanks. Pistachio 12:28, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I have corrected the template to match other Derivations categories. --EncycloPetey 04:24, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks :-D How could I edit the new wording 'The following is a list of Aramaic words related to etymology of the Persian-derived words', from Category:arc:Persian derivations and stop it from adding words into Category:arc:Persian language and Category:arc:Iran? Pistachio 07:37, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure about the answer to the first question. The documentation for the topic cat setup has never been properly documented, so I usually have to dig around each time something like this happens.  I expect that wherever the text is located, the category problem can be fixed from that location as well. --EncycloPetey 07:41, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The topic cat templates were never really "officially" changed, although it seems like there has been a pretty substantial shift toward them. If there are specific areas that the documentation is lacking or if you have ideas for some sort of unifying document, I'd be willing to work on it. I think that Template talk:topic cat was the closest I ever came to documentation, but one thing I never did was do a walkthrough or use case-type document. Mike Dillon 04:30, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Smoothing out page titles
Please create MediaWiki:Pagetitle-view-mainpage with the text "Wiktionary, the free dictionary". This will cause the title bar on Main Page to read simply "Wiktionary, the free dictionary" instead of "Wiktionary:Main Page - Wiktionary". The title bar on all other pages will remain the same. —Remember the dot (talk) 22:47, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * That's pretty cute, now all we need to do is stop this "page-contents is stuff that is spelt like the title" idiocy that's so omnipresent :). Conrad.Irwin 22:54, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks for creating the page for me! What do you mean by "'page-contents is stuff that is spelt like the title' idiocy"? —Remember the dot (talk) 23:02, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * WElll... It's an irritation here that color is a seperate page from colour, that a has so many different sections that are not really related, etc. etc. It'd be nice to do something better, but I've yet to come up with a grand super-plan that didn't have a major flaw. Conrad.Irwin 23:04, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Ah, I can definitely see how that would be a point of conflict. I hope you guys get it all worked out.
 * By the way, have you considered using Firefox? It has spell-check built in, so it'd help you avoid common spelling mistakes like "seperate". —Remember the dot (talk) 23:10, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Spell-checks are only useful if you type common words in a single language. Wiktionary is multilingual and uses extensive coding. --EncycloPetey 23:14, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * True. Spell-check is more useful when leaving comments on discussion pages than when writing dictionary entries. —Remember the dot (talk) 23:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)